shibulon

I would have thought we should cbet K9s otf at a high frequency leaving us with a limited selection of blocker hands to choose from given our line.

Thanks for the post sauce. I was hoping you could clarify what you mean by "indifference" in this context? It would help me understand your post much better.

Thanks

Why do we like 3betting pre? Could you explain the reasoning please, thankyou.

Leading with fish in the middle seems like its the best way to get money in the pot with our strong hands. Having a weak checking range shouldn't be a problem because CO cant bet the flop without gutters when the fish is in the pot so he wont have enough air to exploit us later in the hand.

Is raising trips on turn a good play?

You think QQ calls pre more than it 4bets?

Deep thinking Nick, I like. Might be a touch fps tho unless youre playing 25/50 online.

We basically have to play AA like a draw but our outs are almost always blocked to some degree. Our draw is also very vulnerable even when we make it.

Ok but at a twenty two handed table how often do you think we have two outs to hit a set? How often do we have one out? Our probabllility of hitting set is highly reduced

Just re read my last post and I was wrong about that last paragraph. AA should still perform poorly in a single raised family pot because players are more likely to be cold calling with hands containing an ace than any other card in the deck. If AA cant flop sets very often due to blockers then it will pretty much become worthless in family pots.

Can we almost conclude now that AA most likely has a limit to the number of callers it optimally wants? Seems like having 8 callers should negatively impact the ev of our hand since our nut outs are so easily blocked.

Thats pretty interesting. If youre in the big blind with 33 and youre facing this action you should call all in because your set outs are clean while on the other hand if youre in the big blind with AA you should fold because most likely somone will have an Ace in their hand. Really shows the importance of having nut equity in multiway pots.

However If the table was playing perfect GTO I dont think AA would ever be in a situation where the whole table was all in preflop but either way its a cool thought experiment and it definitely showcases some important properties of multiway play.

Aces should perform much better than this in a single raised family pot because the blocker effect wont exist like it does in your example above. In family pots it seems like most of AA equity will come from hitting top set.

What do you think about the preflop raise with 22? Seems unorthadox.

I dont think nick was saying that jamming is suboptimal in this spot.
You need to make your best guess at your opponents most likely strat and then take the appropriate line against that strat. He never gave his thoughts on what strat that might be.

. Im simply interested in poker and this seems to be something that people have mixed ideas about. I was hoping to clarify it.

Your point didnt come across clear to me. Are you addressing something I said in particular?

Also getting all the money in preflop with the other 8 players is not the same as getting flatted by the other 8 players. When we get all the money in preflop we realize exactly 100% of our equity. When we play a 9 way flop we should have a hard time realizing that much. In a heads up pot we should realize much more than 100% of our equity. So I guess the very simplified question is whether its better to realize less equity in a larger pot or is it better to realize more equity in a smaller pot.

Im forming these thoughts right now btw so im pretty much just thinking out loud and posting my thoughts for anyone to find flaws or faults in.

Ok but if we raise and get called by the other 8 players our hand will be too weak to cleanly valuebet on 90% of flops. We pretty much need to flop a set to feel good about putting money in the pot. And since our opponents are balanced they will make it hard for us to realize our equity by betting and raising with perfectly polarized ranges.

Hey Nick, If BB is trying to make SBs weakest bluff indifferent to betting or checking on the flop does that mean that a stronger hand like A2 should always be checked back by SB?

I also think some of the confusion is that dozer seems to think that sb should now cbet every bluff in his range. That is not true if it leaves BB an exploitative counter startegy.

Its closer than that mang. Your counting is a bit flawed with no weighting and you missed 78s

I dont see why you think barreling with Aces is out of the question in super deep play.

Your argument was that our hand will be face up but that is only a problem if the rest of our range doesnt connect with enough flops. If we have a very well balanced bluff range we should make enough nuttish hands on flops that villain cant exploitatively auto raise our cbets. We will also have enough air to make villains bluffcatchers indifferent on all streets. So I dont really see how its so different from 100bb play as long as our range is well constructed,

Ben when you say raise to 600 are you assuming we have a polarized 2% range of AA KK and bluffs?

Cool. Its interesting to think about how a computer approaches these situations. I guess its not that practical for humans to think this way tho.

Sant, Im struggling to understand your post(due to my own lack of knowledge). My understanding of balanced river range construction is that we should figure out how many hands our opponent needs to defend to avoid exploitation and then figure out our value range based on that. Only then do we add bluffs to balance out our range. So in my mind we always figure out our value range first.

Is my approach wrong?

Sorry for being a fish but what do you mean when you say the preflop caller gains precision in his betting lines by using 3 options? What are his 3 options and when would he ever be limited to one option?

Ha awesome. See you at 25/50 ;)

Hey Nick since you released this vid a while back I'm wondering if your views on cbet sizings when we hold a range advantage have changed? I think I remember in one of your recent vids you talked about cbettting everything for a small sizing when your'e ip. Any clarification would be cool.
Great series btw

Nick, what should our value/bluff ratio be on the turn?