erdian's avatar

erdian

83 points

Generally live steamed players CALL much more then just 4-bet light. UNLESS you have clearly seen they do it with any xxxx you have to assume a strong range. This would have been a much better spot if for example CO just cold-called the 3-bet.

Unless he knows isolation, but for some reason alot of these ''special'' players just call more then they raise in general.

To be honest, your call preflop is not very good. It's better to 3-bet this hand yourself. SINCE you can get HU and your hand has about 50% vs a 30% open. If he can re-jam that wide.

Jan. 4, 2019 | 9:26 p.m.

I think I got it. 1st hand as it seems you are kinda(UTG) You can probably call and play very timid and passive unless based on tells is a fold. Lows sets and unless the flop is perfect 236/A23 its hard to bet for value. Mostly it's hard to see a flop cheap.

Second hand is a raise, Hight connected cards. when you flop GIN its gonna be 2pair+draws of some kind. Worst case scenario if ONLY K high fd. U can play it passive. But you aim to hit STRONG or get out.

3rd, most likely a raise. Will create quite nice SPR situations, I wont fault you for calling either then playing it timid.

Jan. 4, 2019 | 1:29 a.m.

I am totally lost here... can you STRADDLE from any position in your game?

Jan. 4, 2019 | 1:21 a.m.

9-handed sb-bb-straddle game, Eff stacks are based on Straddle.
Eff stacks 200 bb's

Hero(HJ) Tag-image 3x with AA94dhds, CO, BU,SB and ST calls.

Flop: JJ3dsd(5-way 15 bb's) checked around.
Turn: 5h, sb check, ST Potts, Hero?

Villian is playing solid, and seems to have moves.We played a hand before where
he had Jxxx on JJ8J2, He bet small OTF and OTT then potted the river. Showed
quads when I tank folded to pott. He acted very differently in that Spot BUT it was 3-way,
he was IP and had the nuts on the turn.

Thing is he bet quite ''hard'' with his body. Then again he might have JT76 and is just happy taking it down.
The players Behind me and sb are all quite passive. So if they have Jxxx they bet flop most likely.
He knows he can have it and bets it like that. BUT my GUT is telling me differently.

Problem arise if I call, The river bricks/diamond and he potts I really have to see how he acts when the card
arrives, and how he BETS. And even that might not be enough to make my call EV+.

From a poker stand-point, Its 5-way and dude just pots he has Jxxx PERIOD. But WHAT IF?

I could bet the flop but I do have some EQ in 5-way pot and if sb/st are x/r Jxxx I hate to bet-fold.

Sorry long post, but it seems not so easy to explain tell related spots that I know of :).

Dec. 22, 2018 | 4:24 p.m.

You answered the question yourself, unless you get a TELL. He has you beat, as these old buggers dont pot into 4-way with AK and worse...The only logical hand you beat is JT, and that should either have been a bet by him as he is IP or just a call OTT.

Actually I think he wont even have that hand, since he might be scared you having Txxx and drawing higher boat, so he should 95% bet it OTF.

Dec. 20, 2018 | 9:05 p.m.

Thank you for making it more clear why you should x-back in this spot.

I hoped the poster could make a comment about if he had a ''feel'' for the spot in some way as his analysis was very clear and strategic.
And the more I play live, the more I think we can put those type of ''emotional/tell'' applications to a hand analysis. And for some reason I see it rare if ever at a live comment post.

Dec. 8, 2018 | 12:11 a.m.

Is it that bad to bet fold on the flop with a 1/2 sizing vs a ''good'' range, or you think he will just x/r with ''alot'' and make you fold out EQ?

I just think that he might decide to call sometimes with 9+gutter/K+gutter and some strange combos of like JJT8/QQT8 perhaps? My argument is following IF he assumes you only have AA here like 90% AND can fold to a x/r he should ALWAYS jam on your c-bet. Therefore you check-back.

BUT if not, I think you can bet here about 1/2 and have SPR 1.25 OTT. Lastly, this part is never discussed in but as it is LIVE, I strongly believe you might get something out of looking at him before he checks to you. Did he double-check his cards/you got any feeling about him? I know this is fishy for online-players but in close spots where u can gain additional EV this is a good one after all Live is made for this and I do believe this is the place.

So I just disagreed with phil about something(maybe the 1st :)) but I think people talk so in depth about perfect strategy that they forget to look at a guy from time to time and maybe find something there? Or you did and I am just argumenting for the sake of it? ;)

Dec. 7, 2018 | 1:19 p.m.

It is SPR about 6, so I dont really understand why u want to pott, It makes more sence if it would be 4 as u can then Shove the turn if villian calls.

A much better strategy imo would be have smaller sizings in 3-bet pots when the spr is bigger then 4, Like 2/3 or 1/3 then you can optimize then on the turn for SPR 1 on the river.

I disagree that check-back is good here UNLESS he will take ALOT of stabs on the turn. This boards hits his range so any kind of pair+draw could x/r from him which you are very good against, I would glady x/r this with 8+T9/J+T9 if I had any FE in his spot. It also makes nice SPR for villian on turn if you just call X/R and he can jam.

But SPR 12 yeah you can x-b, but I just think he will have so many draws in his range here that it ''feels'' like betting has to be better in general? You might go small here like 1/3 or 1/2 so can comfortably call x/r and the decide on Turn if he potts into you with money behind.

Nov. 27, 2018 | 3:32 p.m.

3 streets of value against what? 88-22/Q with worse kicker?

Nov. 16, 2018 | 5:14 p.m.

Eff stacks 76 bb's, I have TAG-image, UTG is TAG aswell, MP seems on the loose side.

UTG,Midpos and CO limps, sb completes.

Hero is on bb with QJhs, raises to 8 bb's, UTG and midpos calls, rest folds.

Flop: TTQshd(26) checks around,
Turn: 5s Hero bets 10, UTG folds, Midpos Calls
River: 4s, Hero jams

Pre: QJo should be ahead or wide limping ranges,
Flop: Cant really go 3- streets and betting makes them fold worse, only protection is vs J9(KJ should raise pre?)
Turn: Might check here hoping for a stab? I am repping AK/AJ/Axs/Kxs here as bluffs.
River: I think I underrepped my hand, villians call on the turn indicated weakness so some fd's should not be here,
is it better to x and hope for him to bluff? His acting looked like he did not want me to bet therefore I assume 5x/66-88?

Nov. 15, 2018 | 11:33 p.m.

I fold if its online I think, as blockers and being in ''top''/''botm'' of you calling range much more relevant. I play alot based on game dynamics and tells live(therefore I am not as good online :).

Oct. 25, 2018 | 2:24 p.m.

Comment | erdian commented on 5-5$ live,2 hands

1st hand: I think you hand is a little to good not to raise on the BTN, u dont have to go big but atleast 2.5-3x is better then just limping. If somebody 3-bets I think u will play SPR 5-6 IP with a hand that flops well in those spots(pair+some kind of draw, the pair will be top-pair usually). Only reason I would just flat if there is maniacs in the hands that just waits to 3-bet with anything. But weak passive I think clear raise.

If the reg is drinking I think u can raise the flop for value vs all random draws, when you elect to call on the flop I think calling turn is better then raising. As I expect K9/K7 to have something to go with it, and based on it I doubt a drinking reg will fold K9 in this spot.

Second hand: If he is very loose-passive and has almost no agression besides nuts ''maybe'' you can just call. But dammit this is live and u said sb is a fish just get it in, u dont get these hands often and you gotta maximize value, Him going 400 into 700 makes it even less likely he has quads, I guess he mostly has 82/K8 here, in my opinion most quads just pots the river hoping u have house, unless you have history and u call him down with AK/AA here...

But just calling in this spots without very specific game dynamics/you and him being very tight is costing you money.

Oct. 23, 2018 | 1:42 p.m.

When he bets the river he is repping T8,85, Most people(if any valuebet sets/AK here) they should be playing 100-200 IF THEY DO :D. It is a hard spot but I believe that if for some reason calling the turn is your play then you have to call river.

It does not change anything and going bet-bet-bet when the board changes so much smells more bluffy in general to me.The thing that makes it ''strange'' is he goes pot-pot, which should translate to a set, then a straight and then a straight again....And why not pot the river aswell? Worked fine for the 2 other streets that where he was repping 2 different hands.

The whole thing smell alot of 88xx, based on how he plays and has the btn(so far) this a holding that should be more often then not if you take a medium player. I think I might call it down on the river and feel fishy about it, but honestly I doubt that it is wrong. As when you find a live-lag they usually bomb the hell out of you compared to a more ''normal'' thinking lag online.

Then again my logic might be just bad here and this dude only shows up with T8 EVERY time. but I think just auto-folding the turn/river just cause he bet is not enought argument in my opinion. And when it comes to GTO and ranges, well it's live dammit! SOULREAD A BIT you lazy bastard! :P

Oct. 19, 2018 | 12:27 p.m.

I assume stacks are 100 bb's eff and he raised on the btn and u called? Or was it more players on the flop?

Oct. 18, 2018 | 5:46 p.m.

I am not only repping straight or set, I do assume that a 3-bet bet sb range vs a ''wide'' BTN range should contain KTs and maybe QTs aswell? The hand I will most often have here is AK,KQ, and KJ. Hecks if I would 3-bet QTs here I would do the same with JTs aswell. But then again unsure if I would stretch it that far.

Sept. 9, 2018 | 10:34 p.m.

Haha, yeah could have been that the way I played he thought I could have AJ, Feels unlikely though as he blocks J, Making the most logical hand combo wise for me to have is AK :D.

Sept. 9, 2018 | 10:28 p.m.

Ty for the reply, he did end up having KJo since I called. I expect the only 5 combos to be A5s,55,54/56s. Dont expect him to open with worse. Maybe 5Ao on a rainy day.

Sept. 9, 2018 | 10:26 p.m.

He is a a very good player compared to the pool. No I do not expect him to fold KJ, but AQ and QJ.

I did say he was good and on the tag side, if I where to elaborate. He can make hero calls if he thinks you are bluffing. The game was ''normal'' no absurd dynamic was going on. He had been sucked out by a fish this session 1 hour before but I did not expect that would affect his play very much.

I am a PLO player in general, decided to play NL this session. So I was unsure about my thought process and line. I sometimes feel a bit fishy in my logic but maybe that's cause I am rusty or did play the hand bad/got negative variance as he did have J9.

As you said yourself, its very hard for me to be bluffing on this board, usually my worst hand should be AT, or cc. Therefore I thought he had to be very strong to call me on the turn and therefore I showed. Me having the A blocks his AJ combos which should be the most off his cold-call monster hands that he calls my flop raise.( He did make a light sigh when calling OTF, I noticed it but again have not played with him enough to know if he was inducing or was a turn of events, turned out he was giving false tell I assume :). )

Sept. 8, 2018 | 11:21 p.m.

Hero A8dd on SB (110 bb's eff)
All fold to BTN who raises 4, hero 3-bets to 16, bb folds BTN calls.

Flop: KcQcTh (33 bb's)
Hero bets 18, BTN calls.

Turn: 8s(69 bb's) Hero All-in

BTN is a good reg, on tagish side. I presume he opens BTN wide when folded to.
On the flop It should hit my 3-bet range(99+,KQ+,A2s+,67s+) better then his calling range I presume? When he calls,
I guess its mostly JT,QJ,AT,T9 ,and cc then J9/AJ. I am unsure if people in general will jam these holdings in
SPR 3 spots so perhaps I am wrong here.

Seems like betting turn with my hand is quite nice, I expect to have 0 sd value and its SPR 1.

Sept. 8, 2018 | 12:06 p.m.

In my games 5bb's open are the standard size. I would say for it to look strange a person has to open with 7 bb's+.

No I do not expect the lag to cold-call 3-bets or make a light 4-bet.

Sept. 4, 2018 | 2:02 p.m.

Hero AA on HJ with 160 bb's eff.

9-handed, Midpos opens to 5 bb's, Hero flats for 2 reasons:
1. Was a lag in the blinds who could squeeze/3-bet light in general
2. Villian seems like a young internet-kid who is tag and capabel. Not sure if we will makes as many
mistakes to a 3-bet compared to a random live-reg/fish.
All fold we go to flop HU.

Flop:JJ5hhc(12 bb's) x,x
Turn: 3c(12 bb's) Villians bets 9 bb's hero calls
River: 5s(27 bb's) Villian quickly bets 40 bb's, he just took a stack and put it in, hero?

I assume he is polorazing his sizing to get max value from 5 or make A high fold?

Sept. 2, 2018 | 3:57 p.m.

It's for live play, I play very little online therefore no stats to take from to begin with. And If I do play online its PLO(NO NL) and I am looking for NL charts

Aug. 26, 2018 | 3:29 p.m.

Ty for your reply guys! :)

Aug. 22, 2018 | 2:47 p.m.

Where can I buy this information?

Aug. 15, 2018 | 10:20 p.m.

As post suggest, can I download them somewhere or you have to buy?
For MMT's 9-handed(I assume same for live/online?)

Aug. 15, 2018 | 5:55 p.m.

TY for comment, the only question is if I have a tight image and bet this flop. Is it worth it to do so if I get 88-JJ to fold often here? And perhaps some Bad Qx aswell? Or is it so much clearer EV+ if I x-back vs their ranges here?
I dont expect to be x/r light here as a bluff since lag knows I am tight. Atleast not ''very'' often as an exploit vs me.

Aug. 12, 2018 | 11:33 p.m.

Midpos(NOT ME) raise to 5x, Hero calls(ON HJ), small blind is the last caller. ALL OTHER players fold preflop. So on the flop(during the hand) I am the last one to act.

Aug. 5, 2018 | 11:40 a.m.

How is this relevant my my questions?

Aug. 4, 2018 | 1:11 a.m.

Post | erdian posted in NLHE: 2.5-2.5 Live line check.

Eff 85 bb's
Midpos raise to 5x, hero calls A7hh on HJ, sb calls rest folds.

Flop: Q75cdh(16 bb's) 3-way
x,x, hero bets 10, sb calls, HJ folds.

Turn:6s(36 bb's)
sb x, hero bets 19, sb calls.

River: 8s(84 bb's)
sb x, hero?(51 left?)

Midpos is lag, playing 1st time with sb. He did say kinda loudly CALL on the turn
as if it was mandatory, putting him on more ''drawy hands'' I assume he would have thought more with a
hand like QT.

Can I riverjam, and is my bet/sizing good? Flop is almost a semi-bluff as I hope to get 88-JJ folding. And
try to brl off Qx with my pos and some bd's. Turn I keep putting preassure on same range. Dont know
about river, he might find calls with 2-pair and some 4x? I assume I have some 9 here as 99,A9+bdfd,97,Q9
but not alot of combos really.

July 31, 2018 | 4:43 p.m.

I assume this is NL hand, just so u know u posted it in PLO section

July 24, 2018 | 5:41 p.m.

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